-=~!PANTHER!~=-

Discussion in 'Meet the Players - Who's Who' started by -=~!PANTHER!~=-, Feb 11, 2015.

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  1. Heya I play on US East 2. I am currently in a goli with full lf3, almost full bo2, i am missing one, full iris and play in EICM clan (Eic Misfits) and i dont know what else im supposed to tell you. ive been playing for about 3 years almost four. on and off, im poor so not fe. yeah. thank you. i guess.
     
  2. MOAR PERSONAL STUFF. Lol that's kinda the point of this place, but still, cool, nice ship so far, hope to see you around there sometime :)
     
  3. MOAR PERSONAL STUFF! OKAY! I'm a teenager and attending high schools with near straight a's im poor so dont spend money on this game. i am also currently in the process of building a computer, so if anybody has any suggestions or ideas, keep in mind cheaper, thatd be great. i just got full b02s and settled an argument so im feeling achieved. im on nearly everyday after school, so 4:00 pm mountain, and on. yeah. thats that
     
  4. Eeey, same situation lol. Just started highschool mid-semester because my parents have very... differing opinions. Lol. So far i'm getting mostly a's but we'll see o_O as for building a computer, what components are you using, and what software for the base?
     
  5. saturn7

    saturn7 User

    >poor
    >wants to build a computer
    Wow, you need to make up your mind. If you are poor, then:
    -Buy AMD APU, they are much cheaper (and slower) than Intel. They come with built in graphics that are typically better than Intel's options.
    -Look out for misleading information about parts (A higher clockrate on a cpu does not mean it will do a task faster)
    -When buying a motherboard, make sure you pick the right socket. Then select the cheapest version of the newest and fastest chipset.
    -Never cheap out on a power supply. 80 bronze should be your minimum rating. Seasonic is a good company to start off. The most power you would need right now is 450 watts.
    -Buy a hard drive from a reputable company. WD and Seagate are good places to start. Don't buy an SSD yet.
    -Make sure you buy the correct RAM. You do NOT need error checking ram for servers. If you need decent speed, buy 8 gigs of 1600mhz DDR3, the higher the mhz, the faster typically (This is where you get into things like cas latency and timing).
    -Don't go overboard on your case. Look at reviews for this.
    -You don't need a fancy keyboard, monitor, speakers/headset, or mouse. Those things come dead last.
    -Never buy stuff you don't need that's marketed for gaming. This is especially true for motherboards, cases, and periphials (or anything mentioned above).

    -Looks like you will have to install linux because it is free in terms of operating systems. There are many flavors.
    --Ubuntu "Baby's first loonix" Linux with Gnome 3 + Unity enviroment (belongs in the trash)
    ---Kubuntu comes with KDE enviroment, Mint comes with Cinnamon environment, Xubuntu comes with XFCE environment, Lubuntu comes with LXDE environment, Zorin comes with Windows look alike environment. Any of these are miles better than Ubuntu.
    --Debian "I know what I'm doing" linux with Gnome 3
    ---Crunchbang with Openbox enviroment (my personal favorite), Kali "Script Kiddie" linux with Gnome 3
    --Arch "I live in my mom's basement" linux, environment not included
    ---The lifted truck or riced out car of linux, used exclusively by posers
    --Gentoo "30 year old virgin" linux, environment not included
    ---Fastest operating system, hardest to install and work on.
    --FreeBSD (Closest to Apple's OSX, but without the Apple idiosyncrasies)

    Notice. Linux is very very limited in terms of games. If you wanted to play lots of games off of steam, go to Windows.

    Have more money?
    -Buy AMD CPU instead of APU (still slower than intel, don't even try to overclock on a stock cooler)
    -Buy AMD Radeon Graphics card, preferably R270 or better (Don't buy reference cooler. MSI would be your best bet here. Still slower than nVidia)
    -Buy Windows, save yourself the headache.
    -Buy PSU with more watts. AMD components are known to be power hungry.

    Not enough help? [Removed]
     
    Last edited by moderator: Feb 15, 2015
  6. Yes, I'm not an idiot, nor a complete child sir. also i have a monitor just sittin around, we had to buy a new home computer after our old, and i mean old one, died and it came with a new monitor, we also have a windows 8 kit lying around, long story short another computer that we were going to upgrade ended up dying as well, im planning on an asus z97 chipset board, i already have a case, got it at a sweet deal, 20 bucks, its a cooler master N400, power supply is going to wait until i get the majority of parts, I would buy amd but, intel has more deals and is more reliable in the long run, more future proof, wd green obviously, if you dont get that for a personal rig youre an idiot, also going with an intel 540 series (probably but depends on later purchase prices) for boot and runtime programs, I would need more than just 450w for the power supply, at least 750 final, which depending where you look isnt much more expensive, even for a modular, just because of the gpu, most likely a nvidia based gtx, windforce as watercooling is stupidly expensive, and just stupid. and an intel i5 and 7 120mm cooler master swiftflow fans with blue or white leds. Yes this is my first build, But i research and talk, and am just not a complete idiot.
     
  7. What are you guys saying ...
     
  8. saturn7

    saturn7 User

    This is you first build, and you are talking to me like I don't know anything and you did all the research in the world and know what you are doing perfectly well. I have been building systems for years. Let's recap on the goal right now.
    > I want a budget computer, this is my first time building a computer
    I looked over the parts you were PLANING to buy. In this case 1x gpu (750ti), 1x mobo, 1x cpu (i5 4xxxK), 1x psu (750w 80 Bronze Rated), 1x hdd, 1x ssd, 7x fans. You did not mention anything about RAM, so I left that out.
    We are already looking at $774. This is not a budget build anymore at this point.
    I checked the list of parts I picked out. 1x apu (A10), 1x mobo, 1x ram (8gb), 1x hdd, 1x psu (overkill, can spare about 250 more watts if you want to add a gpu, 450w 80 Gold Rated), 1x case
    This full on system I suggested is $423. Much cheaper than the one you suggested you did research on, because lets remember that you are on a budget and in highschool.
    Mind if I refute your argument point by point?
    >Asus w/ Z97 chipset - This is your first computer and you are already asking for an overclocking chipset. Not to mention, a gaming motherboard (because no budget z series motherboards exist) from ASUS. Yes they are a good brand, and yes this is a good choice if you know what you are doing, but they are very expensive. This is your first build, you shouldn't overclock, and do not need a chipset starting with a z. We are on a budget.
    >Intel has more deals and is more reliable - This is a flat out lie. When it comes to computer hardware, especially CPUs, there is really no proof for a brand's reliability. Most people throw out their cpu before the end of its lifecycle. CPUs are good for many years. Intel is also the last company to have deals. They constantly have the most expensive hardware compared to amd. For instance, AMD's 8 core is $150. It preforms just as well as an i5. An i5 is $250. A whole $100 more for a cpu that is just as fast. We are on a budget.
    >WD green or ur idiot - WD green is a low tdp hard drive. A little slower than the rest of WD's lineup and consumes less power, odd since you want a 750w psu. WD blue is objectively the best overall. Black is slightly faster than Blue but more expensive. Red is for RAID systems. Velociraptor (what I have) is an enterprise drive with noticeably faster read and write times compared to black, but is expensive. Most people I know buy blues for storage and main drives (main if on a budget).
    >SSD - It is hard for me to take you seriously if you want an SSD in a budget build, and use it ONLY for booting. SSDs are fast and nice for speed, but are not the thing for a budget. It is about $0.50 for each GB on a SSD, where on a HDD, it is about $0.04 per GB. SSDs are about 10x the price of an HDD. We are on a budget.
    >Windforce GPU - Gigabyte pushes their cards a little harder than the rest, but charge a lot more money than their competitors. They are marginally faster. MSI is the best all rounder because they have a competitive price, and cool better than reference boards. They are the best manufacture for getting the most out of your money. Do not waste your money on a polished low end card. A reference version of a mid grade card will be miles faster than a low end polished one. However, a GPU is an expensive piece of hardware, regardless of if it is high or low end. We are on a budget.
    >nVidia - Yes nVidia is the better brand of GPU, but like Intel, more expensive. Right now, the fastest single GPU from AMD can be had for $300, the R9 290X. From nVidia, they have the GTX 980, for $550. $250 difference. The 980 does outpreform the 290X, but only by 17%. You are paying about $14 for each percent. We are also on a budget, need I remind you once more?
    >Watercooling is stupidly expensive - Oh, so now you care about the budget. Watercooling is expensive because it requires at least $50 to start off with a single rad closed system. Standard heatsinks can be had for much cheaper, but in cooling, you get what you pay for. Let us also not ignore the fact that several high end air coolers that compete with watercoolers can cost MORE than the water coolers. When you get into high end cooling, anything goes. You could have either for the same price. Lower end cooling, there are no water coolers, only air coolers. But we are on a budget. CPUs come with coolers and GPUs, after market ones, come with decent coolers.
    >7 fans with LED lighting - LED lighting does nothing but raise the price of the fan and make you look like a ricer/poser. Your case is a coolermaster N400. These are not closed up cases that need fans like a Fractal Define R4. They have adequate airflow all across the case. The intel and nvida components you wanted put out much less heat than AMD, there is no way you need 7 fans for that system. The only, and I mean ONLY reason why you would need 7 fans is when you are running dual GPU, but even 7 fans is over kill for this. Your case can support up to 9 fans. There is already 1 fan in the front, and 1 in the back. Leaving 7 spaces available. The PSU will take up 1 fan slot, regardless if it has a fan or not (most have a fan on the bottom). If you bought the case with a window (to show off your sick leds an guts yo), the window replaces one fan slot, so you are down to 6 spaces. If you are like me and blow money on a dual rad watercooler, you are down 2 fan spaces. So, you will be left with 4 spaces. You do not need fans, CoolerMaster Sickleflow (not swift flow) fans are expensive and look ugly, especially with lights. Since you are not running SLI/Crossfire, you do not need any more fans. Did I mention that we are on a budget?
    >750w PSU - When you look at wattage ratings, you look at PEAK power. 450w means that the most it will ever use when you are pushing the very limit, be it a GPU, CPU, or PSU (in this case it is producing, not consuming). Other than that, your computer will use less power. 750w is only necessary for a SLI/Crossfire setup that needs 24 amps on it's 12v rail. 450w is only necessary for a system with 1 gpu that consumes 250w (if you go amd) or 300w (if you go intel). We are on a budget. SLI/Crossfire is out of the question. If you want a video card, go 450w. If not, go 250w to 300w.

    Also
    >We are buying a new home computer - Looks like this will be a shared computer. I am sure you parents and siblings are definitely interested in having a computer with noisy 7 LED fans, a gaming motherboard and GPU, and a high wattage PSU. I bet they get on the computer only for the soul purpose of maxing out the settings on Metro: Last Light. They want to spend obscene amounts of money on those features that they will definitely use, care about, and take advantage of.

    Trust me on this. I have been building computers since middle school, throughout high school, and in college.
     
  9. $100 for the mobo , im not saying that intels processors are more reliable im saying that intel as a company is reliable, internet and connections have alot of deals for barely used, or even new processors and i only want led fans because they exist. when i say windforce i should probably say the design of the fans, ie intake from i/o, i have a locked deal for an i5 4690k from a good friend that just bought a new i7, $125, 750w psu is only because i plan on upgrading parts in the future, another reason for intel, i have found deals for this both online and at local refurnishing stores for around $80, it works, dont need bronze, if i wanted bronze though i could find another deal, probably aroun $150 but eh, 7 fans, didnt buy the windowed version, i did say budget, not complete poor build, budget is bang for buck, $700 is still a budget build for a gaming pc, also i never said we are buying a new home comp, we already did, which is why i have the screen lying around, who needs a mechanical keyboard when they dont play competitively, RED drives are for NAS, which i do plan on setting up in the future, FUTURE, also, i assume you think i am using my parents money, which i am not so a farm labor job is fine for what i am doing, Green drives are cheap, or at least cheaper than the ones i found, all of the things, or at least the majority, i am buying, I am buying, are designed to last, a $400 dollar pc is great if you plan on making another one in about 3 years, whereas mine is upgradeable for fractions of that plan. I also assume you looked online in places like ncix or amazon, or the companies websites, which is great but you dont find half off deals online, closing stores and clearances for new items in actual stores where i live make computer parts pretty cheap and easy to obtain.
     
  10. saturn7

    saturn7 User

    >intel as a company is reliable
    You should be buying things based off of the hardware and specs, not because I like X company better than Y company. Intel or AMD will not do anything for you if you buy a CPU. Warranties from companies ONLY cover manufacture defects. Things not covered by the warranty include chipped/cracked lids (someone tried to de-lid the processor, or the consumer damaged it), Bent pins (someone did not insert it properly), and burns/heat damage (someone overclocked it improperly).
    >I only want led fans because they exist
    Why not save your money on placebo fans and use it to buy better hardware that can go faster. Same reason why you buy a high end graphics card instead of a midrange with a fancy cooler. You really should be looking at function over form if you are on a budget
    >Windforce
    There are cheap card with with windforce coolers and expensive cards with windforce coolers. These are manufactured by gigabyte. Since you seem to want fans, I take you are concerned with cooling of the cards and having a lower temperature. The windforce LOOKS like it will be the coolest card, but that is completely false. Here are temperature reports between manufactures when it comes to cards. ASUS STRIX was the lowest with a maximum temperature of 62 celcius. MSI TwinFrozr was the 2nd coolest with a maximum temperature of 64 celcius. Gigabyte Windforce was the 3rd coolest with a maximum of 69 celcius. EVGA ACX was the 4th coolest with a maximum temperature of 74 celcius. So if you are concerned about temperature, get the Asus. Performance wise, Gigabyte has the highest boost clock and over clock, which is why it needs extra heatsink material, an extra fan to cool it off. However, the MSI's overclock sits right next to the Gigabyte, having identical performance, but runs cooler and quieter. I would also like to point out that all of these cards are open air designs. The intake is NOT the at the io ports where the vents are. The intake are the fans on the surface, which suck in air from the case, blow it onto the heatsink, and exhaust it all over the case in all directions. They do not vent out of the case like a blower style cooler. However, knowing that the Gigabyte requires much more length and another fan to keep up with the competition, it has the objectively worst cooler design. We are looking at this when it comes to cooling capacity. Here is how much each fan can cool (higher is better, representing the performance of each fan to keep the card cool at a stable temperature) ASUS STRIX can do 31c per fan. EVGA ACX can do 37c per fan. MSI TwinFrozr can do 32c per fan. Gigabyte Windforce can do 23c per fan. You want the windforce for the reassuring looks of cooling capacity, and you even said yourself that you liked the looks of the design. I am pretty sure you did zero research into it aside from looking to see which card came with the beefy looking cooler.
    >Used i5
    What bugs me about this is that, is the model you mentioned is new and is unlocked, meaning you can overclock it. Your friend did not own that i5 very long before buying an i7. I do advise against buying used hardware, especially in a case like this where one could of overclocked the processor, damaged it during the process, and bought the i7 as a replacement. If he knew what he was doing to begin with, he would of just got the i7 instead of buying the i5. I would be very careful with this processor. If you ask for a reason why he is selling it and if he says anything like computer kept crashing/bsod, chances are he damaged it and he is trying to recooperate the loss. If you ever recall him complaining about computer crashes before he decided to sell you the processor, chances are he damaged it. If he had no problems with it, then it might be ok.
    >cheap 750w psu
    Never cheap out on a psu. 80 Bronze is the minimum you should be buying. If you buy something cheap, expect the following to happen: PSU will never operate within the stable voltage ranges, with cycling voltages will damage ALL of your components. This is called a rippling voltage. Once put under stress, the PSU will die from overheating, very far away from its max output. If you buy a high wattage (500w) cheap psu, the psu will explode (not like a puff of smoke, but more like an actual fiery explosion) at half the maximum output. This will take all the parts out with it. You want to buy a very high wattage cheap psu, and put parts on it later. That psu will take out your entire system when it fails, because you desided to cheap out on the psu. This happens because a cheap high wattage PSU is really a low wattage PSU with a fancy sticker and a slight tweak.
    >750w
    like I said, you ONLY need 750 watts if you are going to run SLI or CROSSFIRE. Adding in a bunch of fans or hard drives requires little spare wattage. If you are running a single GPU, you only need 500w. With 500w, you can have you whole system plus a bunch of other stuff like a RAID configuration or a custom watercooling loop.
    >Refurbished anything
    All sales are final on refurbished items. If you buy a hunk of junk, you are stuck with it. No refunds. They were refurbished for a reason, something went wrong, and don't compare to things in new condition.
    >budget is bang for buck, not completely poor
    I did not pick the cheapest components possible. I know for a fact that the parts I picked have the better bang for buck. I stated earlier that the 8 core was much cheaper than the i5 and could run just as fast. I also mentioned that the R9 290x could compete with the GTX 980 as well, despite being $250 cheaper as well. And I have no idea why you wound want bang for buck, then turn around and say you want to buy led lit fans. Those do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to improve your computer's performance. All they do is move air around. If you really wanted your PC to run cooler, you would open up the AC vent to your room to let colder air flow in. More fans will only muster you about a 4c difference.
    >$700 is a poor mans budget
    $700 is enough to buy a superb system if you know what you are doing. It is even better if you are getting a discounted i5 to where you can compete with $1000 computers, but still at this price point, we need to focus on core parts that we choose, not flashy led fans.
    >who needs a mech keyboard
    Who needs led fans when you already have a case with a reputation for being one of the most open-air cases. Who needs led fans if you are not going to overclock or run SLI or CROSSFIRE.
    >Future proof and upgradeablity
    If you knew how fast hardware advances, you would not be making that argument. We are exponentially growing. Each time a new generation of RAM is released, there is nothing backwards or forwards compatible with it. New chipsets and sockets come out almost every 2 years for intel, and for the current socket 1150 socket, there has been THREE revisions since 2013 when it was first introduced. Nothing about computer technology is future proof given the rate of expansion we are at. The socket we are on is reaching the end of it's life cycle. The only thing future proof about it is the PCI Express 3.0 lanes. Other than that, there will be no upgrading to newer parts of this. The best thing you can do right now for being future proof is waiting for the next socket to come out and pray that intel or amd holds onto it.
    >Green drives are cheap
    Green drives are optimized for storage capacity and power efficiency. They are storage drives. Segate drives are even cheaper, and since the technology of spinning platter HDDs has gotten old, their technology has matured to where everyone is stable, and you really are just best off buying the cheapest HDD. You are probably finding all of these things on sale somewhere.
    >Designed to last
    Yeah, we are concerned about longevity when they become outdated in a year, not to mention you stated that you plan on upgrading later in the future. I'm not advocating that you buy garbage, but you do have the wrong idea about a lot of this. Naturally so because this is your first build and you have zero experience in any of this.
    >local deals and closing stores
    This really only happens once, unless if you have an endless supply of microcenters that are closing and reopening every month, you are stuck to the internet. And from what I find, newegg typically has the lowest prices out of any place, local and on the internet. I did not use them specifically, I used a different website that found the lowest prices available for the part online.